The headline in the past week was obviously the signing of free agent Justin Williams, but along the Francis also made a series of moves adding depth forwards. First he re-signed Derek Ryan. Then he added Josh Jooris from the free agent pool. Then traded for Marcus Kruger. The additions increase the number of forwards on one-way contracts to 13 and that does not even include Phil Di Giuseppe who is qualified but not yet signed.
Today in the Thursday Coffee Shop, we will try to make sense of the sudden logjam of depth forwards competing for slots in the 2017-18 Carolina Hurricanes opening day lineup.
You can decide if you want to comment before or after perusing today’s Daily Cup of Joe where I profile the players involved and offer some thoughts on how it all ends up.
Discussion questions
Since the polls and discussion questions overlap and the poll answers are a bit long, let’s put the discussion questions first today.
1) What do you think Francis/Peters envision for the #9 forward and the fourth line? Do you think that vision will hold up through training camp?
2) If you had the keys to the castle, what would you do with the fourth line for 2017-18?
3) How do you think the logjam at the bottom of the forward ranks gets resolved (if it does at all)?
Carolina Hurricanes polls
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Go Canes!
1) I think RF and BP do see the 4th as a defense first, solid NHL player line. My guess is that BP especially wants to avoid a repeat of the start of last season where the Canes give up big leads in the last half of the game. With the addition of Williams and the “next-step” development for Aho, Teravainen, and Lindholm, RF and BP think they have more offense than last season. But the first two games haunt them (not to mention the other 4-5 games where the Canes either saw a win slip away or suffered a loss in the last 2 minutes). So BP wants a line that won’t “give anything away.”
2) I would build a moat. Seriously, as I said earlier I was adamant about having all four lines as scoring lines. But I see the plan that RF and BP have. I am fine with it as the additions are definitely upgrading the team with a clear focus on getting the points to make the playoffs.
3) Again just a personal guess–but I think the Canes add one more veteran (I really believe they have an offer out to Jokinen) and start DiG in the AHL and Ryan and McGinn as healthy scratches. One of the young guns can prove in the first 25 games or so in Charlotte that they are ready. Jooris, McGinn, and even Ryan and Nordstrom are on pretty cheap contracts. So I don’t think money will prohibit bringing up Foegele or Gauthier in late December or January.
All this is mere conjecture–like RR and dmiller my prognostications have been very wide of any reasonable mark so far.
1. I don’t think there really any speculation what BP and RF want to see as a 4th line, given the signing of Kruger and Jooris.
2. There is no mistake I had been looking for a 4th line with scoring potential that would have additionally kept open spots for the young forward talent in Charlotte to have legitimate shots at NHL ice time. I thought it would have been exciting and fun hockey. I admit I was disappointed when the reality failed to match my hope but I can see what RF/BP are going with and why on the 4th line.
3. Ryan is a better offensive player than either McGinn or Nordstrom, and can play both C and W. He has value on the 3rd line, maybe the 2nd. So his role is Top-9. I can’t help but think that even though McGinn got his one-way this year, he is going to be blocked out by Nordstrom who better fits BP/Rf’s vision of the 4th line and is better on the PK.
As an aside, I think you are right that PDG most likely hasn’t signed because he wants a 1-way. I don’t think RF’s reticence is because of the depth forward signing. I don’t think RF ever wanted to sign PDG to a one-way; Phil simply hasn’t earned it yet with his play.
Jooris was something of a scorer in college, so we’re not giving up a lot to have him on the 3rd line. McGinn isn’t quite as good on the PK as Nordy, but he’s still very accomplished. As far as scoring upside is concerned, McGinn easily surpasses Nordstrom.
1/ The identity of this team is defence and the PK (shoutout to fogger for putting it in plain English yesterday). With the Darling signing and by not trading one of the Core 4 for Duchene, etc., we have protected/improved the defence part of this, but we had work to do to protect the PK part. I think the Jooris/Kruger signings solve the PK problem while providing a small incremental upgrade in possible offense on the 4th line.
As for Forward #9, I’d like to believe that RF and BP are saving room for a rookie to earn a spot – I think it’s actually safer to insert a rookie into a scoring line and have them not score than insert them into a defence-first checking (4th) line and be untrustworthy on defence. However, I think that there are at least equal odds that we either see (i) another trade for a Top 9 that includes PDG/McGinn + futures both to break the logjam and to make room on the roster or (ii) Ryan start out in that slot but on a short leash if his production doesn’t match the production of the Forward lighting it up in CLT.
2) Actually, I think this is the right strategy for building the 4th line and the team. I know this makes me look inconsistent: I’ve been a proponent of the “weak-link” idea that wanted to upgrade scoring across all lines as a way to improve offense without the need for the big-bang 1C, but I’m reevaluating that idea in light of our identity as a team. Inserting rookies on the 4th line might be the way to go after the Trade Deadline to evaluate talent, but solidifying our Team Identity is a huge asset and we should encourage it. It may make us look more like OTT than TOR and be a little less exciting to watch, but it’s our best formula with the players we have to wins games. And our 4th line players this year do have more offensive skill (I think) than our 4th line players last year.
3) Again, I think we’re just as likely to see a trade that includes one of the players in the logjam than seeing us standing pat and letting BP sort it out in Training Camp. At this point, I agree with you Matt that it’s Derek Ryan’s spot to lose. I wouldn’t want to see us take on a player with a contract longer than 1-2 yrs, but looking at our schedule of expiring contracts, there are going to be spots open for our youth this time next year.
One more thing … Now that McDavid is extended, it sure looks more likely that RNH is the odd-man-out with EDM’s cap situation. A one of Ryan/PDG/McGinn + futures deal for RNH might clear things up for both sides … to dream is to live.
I like your RNH idea. Boy, that would sure put the icing on the cake.
Edmonton is good for another year before cap space becomes an issue because of McDavid and Draisaitl signings. Listening to Chiarelli, he is going to stay with the same team and grow it for as long as he can. RNH will stay an Oiler this year, I expect.
Echoing RaleighTJ’s thoughts, I’m becoming less sure that RNH is automatically gone either this summer or next for 2 reasons.
First is that if I pencil Draisatl in at $9M, I think it’s possible that Nugent-Hopkins could still fit. Edmonton does not have a ton of players due sizable raises past the big 2, so if you figure the same $3M-ish salary cap increase next year, RNH could fit.
Second and somewhat related is that I had a detailed conversation with an independent who covers the Oilers. People (myself included to some degree) have RNH pegged as an expensive C3 behind the big 2. But that is not the reality of the 2016-17 season. For most of it, their model was to use RNH in Jordan Staal-like role centering a line that took as many of the hard match ups as they could get. Then they tried to get McDavid w/Draisatl on his wing as many favorable match ups as they could to aim for scoring. It generally worked well. RNH had a modest season offensively, but if you consider it in context of role maybe not really. And if the Oilers want to continue playing McDavid/Draisatl together, they need to have a solid C2, and $6M is not a horrible price for that especially for one who brings a decent balance of offense and defense like you want for that role.
We’ll see. Nugent-Hopkins is still the next big contract on the chopping block in Edmonton, but I am less sure that he must or will actually be dealt.
Matt, looking at Edmonton’s line combinations and specifically, RNH’s use, he spent the vast majority of his time with Eberle and Lucic (43%), Eberle and Pouliot (19%), Eberle and Maroon (17%), and Kassian and Pouliot (13%). He only lined up with Draisaitl 6% of the time and except on the occasional power play group, never lined up with McDavid. It would be interesting to see him line up next to Skins and Stemper. But that’s a big salary bump.
1) I agree with ct and rtj, 4th line will be a really hard defensive line to play against. It is pretty obvious what RF and BP are thinking with the additions of Josh Jooris and Marcus Kruger.
For #9 forward I do not view Ryan as 4th line. I view him as 2nd or 3rd like rtj said. I do not know if we are done yet. We could be but RF could still choose to upgrade the team further. For UFAs, Jokinen and Vanek are both still out there. There are two teams who will probably have cap issues. With the Oilers massive contract which just occurred, RNH could be a cap causality. Toronto could also be in trouble and move JVR. These are real possibilities. I can see RF waiting around to see if either of these open up. Other teams are looking also, so if it does not happen then maybe he goes back to looking at Jokinen and Vanek. We could also be done but there is time before the beginning of the season to see what opens up. I also think Zykov, Foegele or Wallmark could come up but RF may choose to give them another year of conditioning.
2) I do not view Ryan as 4th line. I agree with the comments on that also. I was originally thinking a scoring line with youth coming up also. I think the year end conference call made it pretty clear that BP did not want AHL, but wanted proven NHL players. I just did not think RF would follow through with that. For 4th line, I see Jooris/Kruger/McGinn. It is a tough call between McGinn and Nordstrom. I know BP likes McGinn’s physical play and I think he can score more. It could go either way.
3) I also agree the PDG wants a one way contract, but I do not see that. It will be two-way. If we do a trade for RNH or JVR I would imagine some of our fringe player could be part of the package (probably along with something else but it would need to be players with small contracts because of cap problems). If we add a Jokinen and Vanek then the remainder of the roster could stay. We could have 14 forwards with the 2 bottom guys rotating in.
Your number 3 (Vanek or Jokinen) would suit me just fine as would dmiller’s RNH.
1. #9 Forward: It’s between McGinn, Ryan and one of our prospects at this point. IMO the 4th line is set with Nordstrom, Jooris, and Kruger. That eliminates them from consideration. I give he edge to Ryan as he has more offensive upside and is a more established NHL forward. IMO the ship has sailed on McGinn and DiGuiseppe. The new players appear to be brought here to expressly fill the positions that McGinn and/or DiGuiseppe were slotted to be in. That means McG and DiG need to WIN a top nine spot. IMO, as it stands now, Ryan will win that slot. (See also raleightj’s number 3. above.)
2. Hold up?: Yes, I believe that Ryan will win the 9th slot unless we make a further move to trade or sign another player. (See also ctcaniac’s number 3.above.)
3. 4th Line: Go with what we have now in talent Nordy, Jooris, and Kruger. I have to admit that I was like ctcaniac and raleightj at first. Thought we were going to develop the 4th line to help contribute to the need for more scoring. Like ct and raleightj since that is not BP’s and RF’s vision, I can live with their view of things and now actually think they have made the right decision on this.
4. Forward Logjam: The starting top 12 forwards will not include McG, DiG, or any prospects from training camp. Right now I would say McGinn is the 13th forward who will earn his press credentials for the most part of this year. I believe RF is going to let the prospects get some extended AHL time to really get them ready for the NHL. He has no reason to rush any of them to the NHL right now. Wallmark at this moment APPEARS to be the closest to NHL ready to maybe contribute some scoring, but that is only based upon 1 year of good goal production in the AHL. If Wallmark starts off the AHL season (1st 20 games or so) and is scoring at a prolific rate, then that will indicate that he has brought his game up and then he becomes a serious threat to be the first call-up.
I wrote my piece I did not get the benefit of reading dmilleravid’s and icecobra’s comments. Now that I have, I think they both make good points. I also forgot to add my disclaimer which is: “My expected probability for error n my opinions is plus or minus infinity.” References can be provided to substantiate this upon request. Hint: If you’ve read most of my stuff, you already have your proof I’m sure.
“My expected probability for error n my opinions is plus or minus infinity. References can be provided to substantiate this upon request.”
Fantastic. 🙂
I think the Nordy/Kruger/Jooris line is our second shut down line. Like dmilleravid said, it may be less exciting than rolling 4 scoring lines, but winning 1-0 on the road is less boring than losing 6-5. As far as the last Top 9 spot, I think the “It’s your job to lose” line goes Ryan, McGinn, PDG, then the Checkers guys(Zykov, Saarela,Kuokkanen) .
dog, you only took one small paragraph to say what took me a half a page to say. Excellent synopsis of the situation. Short and sweet and to the point.
If Jooris has a good camp, I see Kruger centering the 4th line with Nordy and Jooris on his flanks. That would be a solid shutdown line as many mention above.
Ginner should hold the 9th spot and/or fill in 4th line. I see Ryan as an interchangeable 3rd line winger/13th forward (not sold on Ryan as 3C). In the end, I think GMRF is not done dealing as we have a variety of bottom 6-forwards. I would package PDG plus pick for 3C.
Bozak is a name I often hear as available and may just fit that 3C role.
What about Stalberg? With the addition of Kruger I wouldn’t be surprised if we see Stalberg come back and play on the 4th line with him. They are countrymen and the reports are that Stalberg wants to return home to Sweden but the addition of Kruger may change that. An all Swede shutdown 4th line of Nordstrom-Kruger-Stalberg could easily be the best 4th line/PK in the league next year.
I know adding ANOTHER forward doesn’t really help things but it’s an interesting thought. Deep teams are the name of the game.
I am actually curious why Stalberg “wants” to play in Sweden when he still has NHL game. I agree, I would love to him back – he was deadly in the neutral zone on the PK.
I am a big Stalberg fan. I had wondered why we did not go for him instead of Jooris. Its possible he wanted too much term? I kind of wonder if the plan was for building this defensive 4th line and Jooris was a good fit, and then Kruger became available and RF jumped on it to fill it out.
One consideration as to why Jooris might be preferable over Stalberg would be Jooris’ experience at center. Having a Kruger/Jooris combination gives the team the “left-draw/right-draw” combination that Peters loves to put out on his checking lines in late game situations.
That is a good point, thanks.
First of all, I am 98% in agreement with dmilleravid (shout out for the shout out and amen to calling EDM about RNH), redryder and dogbutler. Yay to defensive identities and (hopefully) not blowing multiple 2-3 goal leads this year!!!
1. DEEEEEEFENSE. The last #9 spot is clearly Ryan’s but I like giving the young kids a shot to take it in camp. I’d be totally okay with Ryan as the #13.
2. DEEEEEEFENSE. Let the 4th be our shutdown line (Jooris/McGinn-Kruger-Nordstrom). Aho-Staal-Lindholm will make a huge jump as our top line. Calling it now.
3. Who cares, yay depth! Resign DiGi, and if we’re where we need to be in February, we can use some of these fringe players to make the acquisition for a playoff push. Training camp is going to be insanely competitive, which is 100% exactly as it should be.
P.S. I like Stalberg, I’d pay $1M for him. But at this point I say let the kids compete. If GMRF feels differently I won’t be sad.
So it is clear, I never envisioned the 4th as a young line. I saw it centered by Wallmark, based on his performance with the Canes last season and presuming he played to that level or better in training camp. I saw Nordy and McGinn on the wings – and would have been happy with Jooris there. Either way was a combination of youth and relative experience and would have opened up a spot (maybe 2) for young forwards in the top 9. I expect BP put the kibosh on that – and the opportunities were there for some good 4th line pickups. I will be watching Charlotte even more closely this season to see how the young forwards are playing – Saarela, Kuok, Foegele, Gauthier, Wallmark, Roy.
I think it may be time to be as excited about our young forwards (and the depth) as we have the past two seasons been excited about the deep young D.
Bill Peters has said twice this summer that he really liked the way Skinner/Ryan/Stempniak played together down the stretch last year. I think from his comments, you can bank on Ryan being the #9 forward and centering the third line unless someone comes into camp and blows the doors off.
I am strongly in favor of using Kruger and Nordstrom as the basis of a strongly defensively capable fourth line. The final winger could be either of Jooris or McGinn, but I would probably give the edge to Jooris given his right shot and center experience for important draws on the other side of the ice.
“you can bank on Ryan being the #9 forward and centering the third line unless someone comes into camp and blows the doors off.” – Factual
Said this elsewhere….the camp battles that I see are Nordstrom and Jooris fighting against McGinn/PDG/Foegele for 4th line slots and Wallmark and Ryan for the 3C. Don’t forget, Peters also said he really liked Wallmark’s game during his call up. Lastly, there might be a slim chance that Gauthier or Zykov could force themselves into the conversation for a 3RW role. That would make Stempniak either expendable or an awkward 4th liner.
There have been a few comments mentioning and supporting the idea of trying to get RNH from EDM because of the McDavid and, soon enough, Draisaitl signings I would add.
I wrote this deep in response to one of those comments, but don’t get your hopes up:
Edmonton is good for another year before cap space becomes an issue because of McDavid and Draisaitl signings. Listening to Chiarelli, he is going to stay with the same team and grow it for as long as he can. RNH will stay an Oiler this year, I expect.
There will be motivation to move him next season, perhaps.
I’m in no rush…
By next year we will have Saarela and/or Kuokkanen ready (maybe before then?) and you will be saying, “Ryan who?…”. 🙂
That totally works too
Wow! Was away until lunch break, and there is already a bunch of great comments and debate piled up to read. My master plan of having a content website but somehow tricking other smart people into creating all of the content is starting to take shape. 🙂
I actually agree with the majority on how the #9 slot and 4th line are most likely to shake out, but at the same time I am surprised how nearly unanimous it is, as I think think the volume of reasonably possible scenarios is huge.
I will answer #2 because playing armchair is the most fun of any discussion questions 😛
If I had the keys to the 4th line, I would go 1 of two ways:
1. Defense focus & use all 3 on PK – McGinn/Nordstrom – Kruger/Jooris – Jooris/Diguiseppe
2. Mixed focus – Mcginn/Nordstrom – Kruger/Jooris – Stempniak
I think if Lee Stempniak becomes a 4th line forward (because we make a top 9 acquisition, or some prospect is just so clearly ready for the top 9), we will make the playoffs. I think it is as simple as that. Lee Stempniak has been an elite 4th liner for some great playoff teams, and he could score between 20-30 pts on the 4th line which would be great offense in that spot, plus he fits the 4th line better than a guy like Derek Ryan. Being able to slot him down would speak volumes about the improving quality of our top 9.
Hi fiftymissioncap…Welcome to the Coffee Shop! Hope you regularly pull up a chair and join the discussion.
I’m not sure the Canes have quite enough depth to push Stempniak down to the fourth line, but the days of having top 9-capable players pushed down the depth chart are definitely coming and coming soon.
Except we need the 15-17 goals Stempniak scores as a Top 9 forward. He won’t get that on a 4th line….plus he kinda stinks at defense.
Hello notopie,
We ‘need the 15-17 goals’ he scores as a top 9 forward ASSUMING we do not acquire another top 9 forward that has the potential to score MORE (or same) than Stempniak in that role. Furthermore, even if we add another player that is projected to produce similarly to 15-17 goals (lets call him Stempniak 2), that will STILL help the offense because Stempniak 1 will play top 9 minutes and get the 15-17 you speak of, and then Stempniak 2 will score more goals than whichever of these 4th liners he pushes into the press box (Mcginn, Jooris, Diguiseppe).
Finally, I can never understand when people say Stempniak stinks at defense. I do not think he is GREAT defensively, but he actually throws the body around, and he works really hard in all 3 zones so I don’t think he is a liability defensively. In fact, if he was paired with two defensive minded 4th liners like Nordstrom and Kruger I would say that line would be more than effective on both ends of the ice.
A line of Nordstrom – Kruger – Jooris, that might sound great defensively, but what an abysmal offensive line! A team with trouble scoring should NOT be looking forward to sending that out regularly as their 4th line. I agree with another poster on here that said it doesn’t really make sense to ‘plan’ a 4th line when the top 9 isn’t really set in stone either. Being able to push top 9 players onto the 4th line, and especially when they also fit there should be encouraged (I believe Stempniak fits the 4th line style just fine, but admit Derek Ryan fits the 4th line style less).
The best evidence I can give is to remind everyone what the Chicago Blackhawks 2012 4th line was:
Frolik – Kruger – Stalberg. Where you have two guys who are ‘great 4th liners’ in Stalberg and Kruger, and one guy who is clearly BETTER than a 4th liner (Frolik is at least a middle 6 winger) which helps boost the line to well-above the average 4th line.
I know everyone has Kruger as the 4c…. but how about him as the 3C or even the 2C. He would not provide as much scoring, however he may not be that far from Staal if they decide to make the 2 line a shutdown line (sort of what it is now). I saw the interview with RF on the canescounty site. RF sounded like he thinks Kruger could be more than the 4c.
You could have:
Aho, Staal, Williams
TT, Kruger, Stemp
Skinny, Rask, Lindholm
Nord, Ryan/Jooris, McGuinn
Just another thought!
Lots of great comments. I agree with those who say Krueger will center a defensively strong line. RF identified three main reasons we didn’t make the playoffs last year – Goaltending, 5/6 D pairing, and spending too much time in our D zone in too many games. He addressed the first two areas with the signings of Darling and TVR. The recent signings address the last reason. Our home record was good enough to get us to the playoffs, but our road record was abysmal. That’s because we couldn’t match up in the D zone with our 4th line. Krueger, Nordstrom and Jooris/? will allow us to have 2 solid units that can take D zone faceoffs and drive play to the O zone. That should be the basis for construction of a 4th line. Just like you need 2 PK units, you need 2 Defensive zone units. That and the improvement that should come from our young players and JW’s leadership/contributions should improve our goal scoring and our road record. I still believe we are a playoff team as currently constructed. There may be other deals, but RF shouldn’t feel pressure to force a trade with what we have coming.
In the spirit of great minds thinking alike, Matt, Chip Alexander penned a piece today that talked about the young forwards competing with the recent signees of Kruger, Jooris, and Kruger for spots on the Canes roster.
Wow! To all the newcomers, what great contributions to the site. Excellent points and thoughts. Please keep it up. This site has been great all along with the likes of puckgod, icecobra, ctcaniac, dmilleravid, raleightj, fogger794, dogbutler, live_free_or_die, minjaben etc., but your input makes it even greater.
Amen to that! Welcome all
1st. The question about the 4th line, I selected OTHER, but it didn’t register, anyway my answer is…I don’t care… YET! It’s much more important to have the best 1st-3rd lines we can…before signing more marginal players (like RF has been doing)!!
I can’t get excited about penalty killing etc. WHEN WE HAVEN’T FINISHED UPGRADING OUR SCORING LINES…??
Where is our top6 CENTER…WE…NEED???
You’re late puckgod, what took you so long? Lol. Just to catch you up, I believe the consensus is: Our goal totals will continue to disappoint, but our goal differential should improve significantly, with our multiple defensive improvements and defense-first team identity…..so, optimism?
The most recent acquisitions are a little bit like going to the store for butter, cream and mushrooms for the gravy but coming home with a bundle of turnips, diapers and Crystal Lite drinkmix because those items were on sale.
We have way too many good, even great, 4th line players, bt not enough high end scoring ones.
I wonder if something like Nordstrom, PDG and a first round pick to Mtl for Alex G is possible (he has now been signed to a 3-year 4.9 million dollar deal, and per Eklund he is still available for trade).
Or maybe Nordstrom and PDG to the Hawks for Hossa (and Hawks pay 2 mill of his salary).
Maybe TVR and a first round pick to Tor or Buf for one of their offensive players (I doubt they would be takers but we could check).
I think the high end defense prospect/player for a high end forward swap is likely next year when our guys come of their ELC and the internal salary budget woes start creeping in.
I am excited about the canes team (hey, if we have magic mushrooms, maybe we can also have magic turnips), but I still feelthat we need to clear out 2 to 3 contracts and bring in one higher end one for me to be super excited.
Breezy. I would like to reimagine your analogy. I think the idea is to prepare gravy for two upcoming parties. You have fantastic mushrooms and herbs growing in your backyard garden. But the first party is this week and you aren’t sure your mushrooms and herbs will be at their peak flavor. So you buy a package of gravy mix as insurance–because you haven’t had a party in 8 years and you don’t want to call it off. Even if it is only a short-lived party you can set the groundwork for the 2nd and many parties to follow by waiting.
I truly believe that RF and BP think we have both top centers and players for a 4th line that can disrupt and score. But they are being patient.
Now Kruger is butter–you need him for both the mix and the fresh concoction. I can imagine a 4th line with Kruger centering Foegele and Smallman or Lorentz. But don’t think you can rush it.
As far as 1C–Aho will eventually be among the top 10 in the NHL. Necas might also turn into a 1C/2C option. I believe Kuokkanen, Wallmark, and Roy should be capable of playing C on 2nd or 3rd lines. Again, GMRF and BP are not going to waste the key ingredients by using them before they peak. Charlotte is the garden–no raiding it until everything is ripe.
Jooris and JVR are a means to make the playoffs this year. Especially in Jooris’ case, he is not a long-term answer. Stempniak is also not likely to be resigned after this season. In the next 2-3 years, there is likely to be 4 or 5 homegrown skaters in the top 9 and 2 on the 4th.
I think GMRF knows just what he is buying. We are all going to enjoy the feast once it is the right time.
Oh goodness! Don’t go applying at comedy clubs because I think there is an element of sleep deprivation in the mix, but in reading breezy’s starting analogy with CTCaniac’s follow up, I just sprayed the water I was drinking all over my laptop screen. Hilarious!
When things get slow in early August, we may just have to dedicate an entire Coffee Shop to food and other random Hurricanes analogies.
That reply makes me a little more optimistic, but also really hungry.
I still think RF needs to shop for a jar of chipotle peppers and some sour cream (i.e. a good hird line center), if you mix the two in a blender you always have a serviceable, even tasty sauce with some bite to it, which is exactly what we want out of a third line center.
As much as we love pot rost, we just have to challenge the taste buds a little and score a victory in the process.
So bring back the Juice.
I concur with Fabdou above in that we are a playoff team as currently constructed (thinking 7th/8th seed at best). Also agree GMRF is in a position of power and in no need to make a move. That said, I would still look to improve the 3C slot by dealing one of our existing 3rd/4th liners plus prospect/pick. Any one of Bozak, Jussi, JVR or others could make us a top 6 team in the East. Easy to ponder speculative trades, including those of the greater RNH kind, but I think a solid 3C could solidify the lines and prevent the over-slotting that has occurred so often in years past.
Lastly, RedRyder hits the nail on the head…awesome site and even better contributors! Coming from a fan of this franchise since the 80s, certainly makes the distance seem less for some of us northern ‘Canes diehards. Thanks again.
Hello everyone. Good to be here. Nice to read some interesting conversation for a change. I’ll try to keep it as short as possible.
1) It’s already been said a few times, but I think Kruger slots in the middle with Jooris and Nordstrom.
2) I’d like to see McGinn-Kruger-PDG for at least a smidge of offense and a lot of energy, but with the signing of Jooris, things got really clogged up. And hey, maybe someone can learn RW? It’s not the best shutdown line. That would be my Nordstrom-Kruger-Jooris all day long.
1) And with Ryan, Jooris and Stempniak going to UFA status next season, you’d have to imagine that RF sees those spots filled with youngsters out of Charlotte as part of the plan NEXT year. I honestly don’t think we’ll see any of them up this season with the exception of injuries.
3) BUT, what’s the possibility of RF waiving some vets after camp to let some young guys guys come in? I’m no CBA expert, but it’s the only way I see anything happening, even if RF has to eat some salary. I think Ryan will center Skinner and Stempniak (as someone pointed out that BP has liked, maybe minjaben?) and the other lines some blender action of the remaining top six. Who knows if that’ll stick through camp, much less the first period of game 1. So #9 I would say is Ryan.
Random…I think Galchenyuk would be nice, but I think RF is too conservative to make a trade for someone who doesn’t have a proven offensive record (despite his projections) as well as being called out for his lack of defensive prowess.
Also…who’s going to wear #86? Looks like they’ve given #16 to Lindholm over Kruger.
Hearyoucoming…Welcome aboard! Grab one of those super latte cups, fill it up and stay awhile.
I still like Galchenyuk, but when Montreal did not re-sign Radulov, I think the money and a scoring roster spot became available to just keep Galchenyuk. I think he comes back into play instantly if Montreal could somehow land Duchene without trading Galchenyuk to do so, but that seems really unlikely since they do not have an extra top 4 D to trade. At that point the most likely trade chip for Duchene seems to be a sideways swap of the two centers since both teams seemingly want to rid themselves of the one they have.
Another point of view is to look at this through the “Rebuild” lens vs. the “Optimism” lens. Once the POV is right, RFs strategy in the third year of the rebuild starts to get logical. First priority was to keep the defensive depth intact. Second, Change goaltending for the better by dumping Lack. Third, let the offensive prospects develop in the AHL, developing chemistry and a winning experience before touching the NHL. Fourth, keep financial resources intact to be able to retain players as their ELCs expire by avoiding contracts with more than a 2 year term. Finally use analytics to create a lineup that rates high by those metrics and can make the playoffs in the process. RF sees making the playoffs this year as a possibility, not a requirement. The requirement is staying true to his rebuild strategies and philosophies.
surgalt. You nailed it. Although my guess is RF thinks making playoffs is pretty close to a requirement simply to get the fan base re-energized. Those of us who obsess are more patient because we have Matt, Jordan and company telling us how good the prospects look. The more typical fan only sees the current team.
I believe playoffs this year is not a luxury but a requirement.
I would have agreed with the 4-part strategy last year, but it’s been too many playoff misses and the Canes attendance is the worst in the NHL.
The “just look at how great we’ll be next year” speech has been given too often by management. This year, at the prospect game, they even kept talking about how awesome the crop of new kids looks compared to 3 years ago (indicating the group then was not good at all). I remember that year and the Canes camp excitement and promise of a bright future.
Looking closely at where we are now I am truly high on this year’s prospects, but the average Canes fan hears the same speech every year and has stopped believing it.
They need to be dazzled, not be told they will have raspberry jam tomorrow.
There were veteran signings on short-term deals to be had this year without giving up too much, and I think we fell short by one.
That being said, I think this team could pull off a miracle and impress this year. And I will go to a game or 3, or 10 and cheer on the Canes big time. But I am still only about 75% happy with RF’s off-season, he would get a B.
The fan base and the team management are not in the same place regarding MAKING THE PLAYOFFS as a requirement. For team management the REBUILD is the requirement. Perennial losing sucks for all of us, but, in the bigger scheme of things the teams lease at the PNC and league revenue sharing temper managements need to go all in now. We are much more short term outcome focussed than are they. We want it next year for sure. They want it for a string of years to come, next year would be great, a long string to follow is the plan. We want it now. They are incentivized to be patient much more than us.
Well, at least we can all enjoy the Canes, the barbecue, the beers, the family nights, the broadcast team, and hope for the best this year.
I sincerely hope you are right and that the endless relocation rumours can be thoroughly squashed.
On an unrelated note, I wonder what JR did with his stake in the teamn. I know he bought a small one.
Can he be the GM of another NHL hockey team while still being a part owner of the Canes.
It was published that JR did sell his shares in the Canes when he took the job in Pittsburgh. I believe PK bought the shares back.