This will be a placeholder for discussion on trade deadline day.
I hope to emerge at lunchtime to see what I missed and chime in on anything of significance.
Carolina Hurricanes 2019 NHL trade deadline discussion — Open forum
by Matt Karash | Feb 25, 2019 | Canes Chronicle, On The Beat
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For fun, here are the trades I would’ve done.
Adding Duchene + Zingel. Columbus gave up a lot of futures and picks but effectively added another top line to their team. If these guys continue playing like they have in Ottawa (and since they’ll probably play together, there is no reason they shouldn’t), the Bluejackets will be hard to beat. It would’ve been fun to see Carolina do that, in a crazy sort of way. I feel sorry for the Sens’ fans, losing Carlson, Hoffman, trading a lot for Duchene then trading him away for a lot less, Zingel and probably Mark Stone. They had the makings of a cup contender, but they’ve traded away all their superstar talent (assuming they trade Stone). Incidentally, they gave up their 2019 first round pick so no hope of a #1 draft pick.
Nyquist for a second + a conditional third. This is a deal I wish the Canes had made. Nyquist is a scorer, has a lot of potential and the Sharks barely had to give up anything to get him. Nyquist would’ve been a nice upgrade to one of the scoring lines.
That’s about it for deals I would’ve done so far.
I am a sucker for the trades where you only pay a lot if it works out. Combine that with the fact that I liken Mats Zuccarello to Mark Recchi as one of those veterans who could boost the locker room/intensity level on arrival, and the Zuccarello trade is interesting.
For those who have not read the details it is a 2nd-rounder in 2019 and a 3rd-rounder in 2020. The 2019 becomes a 1st if the Stars make the 3rd round of the playoffs. The 2020 becomes a 1st if the Stars re-sign him.
That seems pricey if all goes well, but again it’s only if things go wonderfully. A playoff berth and 1st or 2nd round exit which would be a huge success costs only 2 high but not 1st-round picks.
Looks like Zuccarello is out at least 4 weeks. Goes to show there is risk with any deadline trade.
There is risk with any player, whether traded or not.
I am that those who were arguing for another Top-6 forward (and not just here) are not now saying we should stand pat. We are playing at an exceptional pace since the start of the year but is that really sustainable?? And when the opposition (CBJ) gets better, you are falling behind.
I think we are going to regret not being able to pull off a RHD-for-F hockey trade, although it is clear Waddell has been pursuing that since the last off-season. And a low-cost rental per breezy’s comment on Nyquist probably would offer more benefit than risk.
I am surprised that Rutherford has not (yet?) made any moves – he is not reluctant to make hockey or rental trades and he has to be wondering what is going on with the Pens.
The Canes as constructed have played admirably since the New Year to the point we are in the mix. They got there without arguably their best shutdown center, not only surviving but thriving during this stretch. That said, there were let downs during that stretch against subpar teams where our offense and attack dried up. This happens to all teams, though we were light on scoring to begin with before things clicked. This is why I think it would be “fools gold” to stand pat at the deadline. March will be a “beast” of a month. If anything, adding a top 6 center or wing with scoring touch makes sense in a year it may take close to 98+ points to make the playoffs. The East is that good.
Side note: If Ferland and the team cannot come to terms on a fair extension, then we should make the best deal by 3PM. In my opinion, the newly popular term “self rental” is a teams way of covering up a dicey situation to the fan base(or in this case a previous deal w/Calgary that would be lopsided). In the end we need to gain from Ferland, via extension or in the form of another asset.
Keeping Ferland and not having to lose picks to pick up a forward in the rental market doesn’t sound bad. If Ferland helps drive the Canes into the playoffs I would be satisfied with that over the gain of a 2nd or 3rd round pick even if we lose him in thhe offseason – he did his job for us. Only if we pick up a F with a “hockey trade” would I think we consider trading Ferland.
Agreed…”hockey trade” or bust.
Let’s assume the primary team goal for this season is to simply to break the 9 year playoff drought. There were 3 teams potentially in the way for the Canes to reach and hold WC2, Columbus, Montreal or Pittsburgh. Columbus has gone all in trading lots of futures for a serious run at a Cup. No way we should engage in that arms war with our much lower goal. We currently actually have slightly better odds than Montreal. and are quickly gaining on Pittsburgh for the last WC. Neither of those teams are engaged in an arms war yet. (Nor are the teams right behind us in the standings.) By that reasoning standing pat does make sense. One caveat, if the assets received for Skinner can be flipped for someone who could improve the team down up front and fits in future plans. Were that player be also “plug and play” ready, McGegg could be used to sweeten the pot if either Montreal or Pittsburgh go for a big splash today.
LeBrun is talking interest in Ferland from VGK, TOR, CGY, and WPG (although since then the Jets picked up Hayes). A deal could still be done depending on how badly each of those teams wants him.
I agree with those who say we should stand pat. Nino for Rask was Waddell pulling a rabbit out of a hat. I am still amazed.
I would not want to dare to screw with our team chemistry even a little bit more. It’s time we decide to dance with them what bring us.
I don’t agree with those who want to acquire scoring talent. In case you haven’t noticed, we are doing very well in that department, thank you very much.
We will find, if we make the playoffs, that we don’t have enough grit. Not nearly enough, especially on defense. Michael Ferland cannot handle the grit that will be arrayed against him alone. A very big, very strong and nasty defenseman would do just fine; Jamie Olecksiak, Jacob Trouba, Darnell Nurse, Radko Gudas, etc. Best to acquire in the off-season.
I look forward to seeing us make the playoffs. We likely will not make it beyond the first round. But we will be in the playoffs.
To me the question on trading Ferland can’t be answered w/o weighing the return. If Ferland to Toronto for Kasperi Kapenen is the question then the committee should strongly consider the deal.
All players are on the ice for practice – which implies no imminent trade, hockey or rental.
Eklund has posted a collection of baffling and entertaining CAnes rumors.
According to him the canes are trying to get goalies, Jimmy Howard, Bobrovski and Ryan Miller (though according to him Miller wants a shot at the playoffs and then retirement, what he does not appear to realize is that the canes are kind of set with goalie for this season, any goalie trade would be forward looking).
The goalie rumors do not make much sense to me Howard/Bob are ok, but would be more of a summer situation, not trade deadline.
Canes are supposedly in discussions with the Leafs about Ferland and Hamilton. The return better be good, and I am not sure Tor is willing to give up the kind of return that makes a trade worthwhile.
Some of his rumors probably have some truth, then again if you throw enough spaghetti at the wall something will eventually stick.
I tend to be on board with maximizing opportunity as opposed to waiting for the offseason (when more buyers drive up prices). If solidifying goaltending for the next 3-4 years is available to us now, then great. If it’s a backup goalie then it makes you wonder if one of our current goalies is battling through a small injury.
Reposting these comments from today’s other post – nothing has happened yet to change my stance on anything yet …
I think the Canes stand pat and ride this team. As we’ve all been saying, Rask-for-NN was our Deadline deal and Staal returning is the same a getting a top-end Rental without having to pay for it. Our defense is solid, our goaltending has been stout – I really can’t think of a deal worth doing that moves the needle all that much without sacrificing too much of the future. Our time is probably not this year so why move all our chips in now.
I think the Canes, PIT, MTL, and CBJ are fighting for three spots. Given that:
CBJ has to be an overwhelming favorite for one of them if they keep both Panarin and Bobs. Even if one of them goes, they are still a favorite. Give them credit for going all-in. I didn’t see that coming at this level and I doubt many others did either. They might win the Metro.
After Saturday night’s collapse in TOR, MTL is probably going to settle for a Wild Card spot at best (which isn’t that terrible if it’s the 1st and the NYI win the Metro and probably better than a lot of alternatives). They’ve been surprisingly solid all season and probably view themselves as having a reasonable probability of finishing ahead either CAR or PIT without doing anything “major.” It’s a market that demands a lot and missing the playoffs at this point might cost Bergevin his job, so who knows … I see them tweaking possibly but not buying an expensive Rental.
PIT is the real question mark. Their defense is really banged up – they got very unlucky Saturday night at the exact wrong time – and you have to believe that they think they are at serious risk of being the odd-man-out and missing the playoffs without making another move. Who knows what they can do to move the needle, but I expect them to do something. To me, they are the weakest team of the four.
All things considered, especially given the trajectory of our play, I like our chances to beat out PIT for the final spot. I don’t think we need to do much and I would certainly not trade one of our RHD now for offense – I’d wait until the offseason. Would I spend a 2nd to add a player like Nyquist? Maybe, but only if I felt like it was a real upgrade.
This is the first Trade Deadline in a long time where I actually don’t want to see our name flash in a notification on my phone.
The Cliff Pu era has ended. The Thomas Jurco era has begun (at least in Charlotte). Since McGegg was not returned to Charlotte today (he would have had to clear waivers) he would not be eligible to play in the AHL playoffs. Jurco is likely obtained to give the Checkers help for their playoff run.
Ironically, the 2019 Tomas Jurco is the 2018 Greg McKegg. McKegg was brought in this time last year to boost the Checkers, and he had exactly the effect that was desired. Here is is hoping that Jurco provides a similar boost to an even better Checkers team this season.
Pu’s production was somewhat, well “shitty” (1G/5A in 44 games with the Checkers), we wish him all the best.
By not moving a RD did the Canes just lose Adam Fox?
Nope, Fox has about a month to go. Depending on how Harvard does in the tourney. They can sign him then and let him be the 7th d.
Giving what the Flyers got for Simmonds, Ferland was not going to bring much.
Don’t know if I would want him but Brassard went cheap – just a 3rd rounder.
Pitt didn’t add a D, that will hurt them.(srry-bad pun).
Why would Fox sign on to a team where there is no room for him to play in the NHL?
lts = the bigger question is why would he wait to come next spring, right before a presumed lockout would further delay a NHL contract.
Or real NHL pay he would sign a contract and get paid for the last month of the season and then have to wait through the lockout to see more money – not ideal for him.
You are assuming a work stoppage. Not convinced that will happen. But you are correct that it would be very unlikely Fox would sign next spring when he could wait a couple months and be a free agent.
Fox doesn’t seem to be in the situation where one year at 900K will make a big difference to him. I don’t think he needs the cash. If he’s smart he’s playing the long game.
It would be interesting to know who his advisors are. If they are the same guys who represent Vesey and represented the Harvard coach Donato you can’t believe anything he/they say.
I thought the Canes would move Fox + prospect or second rounder for Hayes or similar at forward, but the management decided to roll with what we got.
Can´t say it´s the worst idea in the world, the team has been on aroll lately. I would´ve liked to see a few upgrades at forward but I did not want to downgrade the D to do it, so time to keep rolling.
Hopefully we can sign him this summer. He will be a good fit and he takes pressure off Aho. Aho looks like he is getting over used right now.
Then use our assets to trade for J. Quick.
Why would the Canes want to trade for a 33 year old goalie who makes big bucks and is definitely on the down side of his career? Makes no sense to me.
Unless either goalie has unreasonable contract expectations I wouldn’t be surprised to see both Mrazek and McElhinney resigned. McElhinney won’t have much juice on the FA market at his age and knee issues.
Oh man, Vegas did not overpay for Stone, that’s for sure.
Now there’s a deal the Canes should’ve found a way to do.
They could’ve traded Ferland for a high pick, packaged that and a second rounder + Necas for Stone and found a way to resign him.
So there’s the third deal I would’ve done for sure.
I think your logic overestimates what we would have been getting for Ferland. We were asking for a 1st rounder and a prospect. Unlikely that was even close to the offers. And I think Stone was only going to go where he would have wanted to resign, and I doubt that was CAR.
Miscellaneous thoughts:
1. Sometimes the best deadline trade is the one not made.
2. This trade deadline needs to be viewed in the context of being in the 3rd year of a rebuild that is going well.
3. Retaining Ferland is part of the state of the rebuild context. Keeping him here for the rest of the season, could morph into both parties wanting to keep him on the team.
4. While Adam Fox is a very highly rated prospect, he is also only a junior in college. Clearing a spot in the top four next season for him is a bit premature. When the season ends for Harvard, he will make his decision based on his wants and needs. The Canes can do everything possible to encourage a player of his age to sign at that time.
5. The next chance to improve the front six at the expense of a very good RHD is at he upcoming draft or the recruitment of newly minted UFA. Nothing happened yesterday to upset either of those processes.